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@jgoerzen The grocery store and hardware store that are the closest to our house are a little over a mile away but that shopping center is like a black hole where my cell phone is completely useless. I'm seriously considering getting a couple Motorola DLRs so I can talk to my wife while I'm at the store in case she thinks of something she needs from the store or needs to get ahold of me while I'm there in general. Do the Motorolas have an internal li-ion battery? Are there any others with similar range that take AA/AAA?

@kelbot The Motorola DLR & DTR have an internal Li-Ion battery that is easy to swap (there's a battery cover on the back). https://www.motorolasolutions.com/content/dam/msi/docs/en-xl/mot_dlr_spec_sheet_en.pdf probably gives you everything you need to know about that. Note that batteries from units you get off eBay, as with any other li-ion thing you get used, may be in various stages of health... but it would take a VERY unhealthy battery to take something that would normally last 14 hours and make it only last, say, 2. 1/

@kelbot My tests were in a rural area, so YMMV on range. But this would probably be one of your best bets unless you go for ham radio, which would let you access repeaters and such. 2/

@kelbot The Motorolas won't take AA/AAA, but a number of FRS or GMRS would. To get similar range, you would need a 5W GMRS radio and one easy-to-obtain GMRS license. https://old.reddit.com/r/gmrs/comments/uodbt1/so_im_fairly_new_to_radios_i_just_received_my/ has some recommendations. I haven't used it, but that Radioddity GM30 looks like a decent deal; 5W for $40 (not sure about the bat situation). 3/

@kelbot I bought the Midland GXT1000 back when it was a 5W GMRS radio. Since FCC banned FRS/GMRS crossover radios, Midland made it a 2W FRS rather than a 5W GMRS radio so it's no longer king of the hill. But, 2W may be sufficient for you. Hard to say really. It can run in 4 AAs. Midland may have other 5W options; anything 5W will require a GMRS license. https://old.reddit.com/r/gmrs/ would be a goo place to look, or https://forums.mygmrs.com/ . I will be interested in how it pans out for you! /end

@jgoerzen It seems like the Motorola DLRs would be my best bet especially if I can get them cheap second hand. I kind of like analog's ability to fade out gracefully rather than just disappear but if they have sufficient range for our uses then it won't be a problem.

@kelbot Yep. You get no warning that you are approaching the edge of coverage with digital. Though to be fair, you don't with analog either, unless you are actively conversing at the time One interesting thing about the Motos: when you push PTT (push-to-talk) you wait about 0.5s for a "OK, you can talk now" tone before you start speaking. If the radio detects that there isn't at least 1 other receiving the transmission, it fails it with a reject tone. You know if you're being heard.

@kelbot In my testing at the edge of the range, if I'd get the reject tone, I could try orienting the antenna different or holding the radio higher and trying again a couple seconds later... There was just a fringe where that could sometimes work.

@kelbot One thing I should add: yes you can get 5W analog GMRS that take 4AA bats and they will get you similar range as a DLR. But they will be twice as thick and twice as heavy and taller. The DLR slips into any pocket I have. My Midland GMRS would have to use the belt clip.

@kelbot
The downside of the DLR is higher new price (though used it's not bad, but you still may have to buy charger. You can get by without programming cable but it makes some things a lot easier/possible). Also DLRs don't receive NOAA weather radio and don't have VOX (automatically tranmitting when a certain level of sound is received at the mic, though in fairness, VOX is usually so terrible I never use it)

@jgoerzen Good points. The compact size is definitely a better fit for me. Would have been nice to have the NOAA radio feature though. That would have been a much easier sell to the wife if they had it X-).

@jgoerzen I saw that there are some radios with some ability to send short predifined text messages. Why aren't there any that include a thumb keyboard and just let you type out short messages?

@kelbot If you go to the updated version of the post at https://www.complete.org/the-joy-of-easy-personal-radio-frs-gmrs-and-motorola-dlr-dtr/ you see a section about Trisquare radios at the bottom. They did have a full numeric keypad that made entry somewhat faster (still darn slow by modern standards). Reasons more don't have that probably include cost, waterproofing challenges, size, etc. Ham handhelds often have a numeric keyboard at least, but the waterproof ones are also a lot more expensive. Note: I wouldn't recommend Trisquares.

@kelbot I haven't used the cheap FRS radios in the last few years. 2W is a lot better than 0.5W so FRS is more capable than it used to be. In some cases, the difference from 2W to 5W won't matter... in others, it will be huge. I can't say. What I can say is that if you're buying radios at effectively $17 a piece, you know there is a compromise somewhere. Build quality, waterproofing, battery life, antenna quality, who knows. You might look for reviews. Eg on Amazon https://www.amazon.com/Radioddity-License-Free-Broadcast-Channels-Earpiece/product-reviews/B07T5DSJGQ/ref=cm_cr_dp_d_show_all_btm?ie=UTF8&reviewerType=all_reviews

@jgoerzen Yes, good point. We wouldn't be using them real intensively but I'm sure they aren't the best quality. I'm seeing comments about the range being 1-2miles at most. That *could* be good enough or may not be depending on how buildings and stuff effect it in our specific use case. I guess the only way to find out would be to try :).

@kelbot So in your use case (both ends of the conversation in a building, presumably in a city) you will not be getting the "at most" range from any of these. That's the most challenging scenario for radios and it may be that none of them, FRS, GMRS, DLR, etc, are capable of it. The only way to know is to try.

The testing I did had one radio in a building and the other in a car -- also a challenging scenario -- but it was in a rural area. So expect less range than I got with everything.

@jgoerzen Ok, thanks for all the input. I'm going to have a think about it before I buy anything. Maybe trying one of the "good" cheap ones that have weather radio functionality would be a good start and if they fail to work in our situation then we at least have weather radios. Then we could try the Motorolas after that if we decide we still want to.

@kelbot Makes sense! Incidentally if you live in an area that is prone to severe weather, you might consider a tabletop weather radio with SAME. I can discuss that some more but it's a whole different topic These FRS ones will let you listen to WX radio but may not be very effective at alerting you to weather warnings.

@jgoerzen We get some severe weather here but not usually as dangerously severe as we had back in KS. The bigger slower severe weather events we always know of well ahead of time because my wife is a meteorologist.

@kelbot Oh very cool! As a Kansan and a pilot, I have two good reasons to very much appreciate meteorologists I have been a "trained spotter" with NWS Wichita for years. My 15-yr-old is too!

@kelbot Man, get your amateur radio license! These things are so darn fun. APRS is really awesome - supports short messages, telemetry (esp. weather stations), and GPS position reporting. Forms an ad-hoc mesh. Has gateways to email. Many handheld radios that have keyboards. Lots of frequency bands, lots of high repeaters for great range, various Internet backhauls.... and if you get into HF, talk to Japan with a wire in your yard.

@jgoerzen X-) I don't need another hobby! But it does sound fun.

@kelbot I have this exact problem. The world is too interesting! Too many hobbies! Photography, computers, radios, airplanes.

But uh, because I'm a... helpful... kind of guy, I'm gonna just leave these here.

https://anytone.org/wp/product/anytone-at-d878uvii-plus/

https://www.kenwood.com/usa/com/amateur/th-d74a/

https://www.complete.org/why-get-involved-with-amateur-radio/